Apparently the only relation to Marxism is that it was apparently written by Pete Seeger who was, as the FBI would say, a ComSymp.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 9, 2010 @ 10:03 pm
Pete “Fence sitting” Seeger? lol
Funny if this had anything to do with Marxism why is it full of such anti-dialectical none sensibilities? Almost as bad a “Let It Be.”, next Lo will be calling Lennon, Lenin!
Hey, popses, stop analyzing lyric, listen to the drone and McGuinn’s twelve-string, and look at the grooving girls in the audience. Bliss!
Comment by Jim Holstun — September 9, 2010 @ 11:14 pm
The song definitely reeks of pacifism and a rosey future, neither of which the working class has in store for them.
Coca Cola Bottling Co. would have probably bought the rights and used it as a jingle except they’d never pay royalties to a fellow traveller of the CPUSA, even if they were loaded with pacifists, which they were.
A much “groovier” song from that era in my view, albeit substantially darker, is “When the Music’s Over” by The Doors.
What other 60′s rock band previsioned the modern environmetal movement & capitalist despoilation of the planet with lyrics such as this:
——————————————————————————–
What have they done to the Earth?
What have they done to our fair sister?
Ravaged and plundered and ripped her and bit her
Stuck her with knives in the side of the dawn
Tied her with fences and dragged her down
———————————————————————
For all his faults at least Morrisson was no pacifist.
The next set of lyrics even have revolutiobary implications, for when it came to taking back the Earth from the ravagers & plunderers he screamed: “WE WANT THE WORLD AND WE WANT IT NOW!
In the song “5 to 1″ he sang:
Five to one, one in five
No one here gets out alive
They got the guns but we got the numbers
Come on yea, we’re takin’ over!
Get together one more time
Get together just one more time
Come on let’s just get the whole fuckin’ thing together just one more time.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 9, 2010 @ 11:46 pm
Hah, Jim Morrison never sold out, at least. This song reminds me of the Monkeys only they took a few extra minutes to write this song. I don’t like anything about this really. This generation represented in this song is all but dead in terms of it’s revolutionary worth. The fact it is in black and white is fitting. Bland, dreary, useless. If mostly everyone born before 1970 had done us a favour and killed themselves we would be better off by now.
Pacificism has it’s place. Don’t become the beast in trying to destroy the beast.
Love,
John Kaniecki
Comment by John Kaniecki — September 10, 2010 @ 1:00 am
If mostly everyone born before 1970 had done us a favour and killed themselves we would be better off by now.
—
Odd, I had the exact opposite reaction when I joined the SWP in 1967. I was grateful be able to learn something from people who had political experience from the 1930s unlike the SDS that had the same mixture of ultraleftism, arrogance and stupidity you favor us with.
“Odd, I had the exact opposite reaction when I joined the SWP in 1967. I was grateful to have be able to learn something from people who had political experience from the 1930s unlike the SDS that had the same mixture of ultraleftism, arrogance and stupidity you favor us with.”
I was being sarcastic, of course, but of course Lo you would – as a typical 1st worlder – not see the difference between people that struggled in the 1930s and you privelege assholes that rule ove the world now.
Apparently the new litmus test for radicalism includes musical taste, as well. I suppose I’m safe since I listen to the Clash, Rage Against the Machine, and Public Enemy. Maybe that will make up for my fascination with Hildegard of Bingen and my occasional enjoyment of Lady Gaga.
Besides, who cares if one post, and a post that contains nothing but an embedded video at that, has “nothing to do with Marxism”? Just because we’re Marxists doesn’t mean we aren’t human and entitled to share our interests and tastes regardless of how “dialectical” they are.
Karl–with regard to Byrds vs. Doors: let’s just remember that, at the end (not “The End”), Jim Morrison was singing with a big band backup (“Touch Me”–no way, Jim).
Also, please remember that excellent rock critic, Rip Taylor, in “Bill and Ted’s Bogus Journey,” when listening to the Doors music: “Oh, I get it–it’s crooning in a rock MILIEU.”
Comment by Jim Holstun — September 11, 2010 @ 7:08 pm
“A time to tear down.”
Comment by Chuckie K — September 12, 2010 @ 3:16 pm
Comment by Michael T — September 13, 2010 @ 1:27 am
I’m guessing Louis loathes that number as much as me. I know I despise it.
First it denies the only successful left wing terrorist action in our lifetime. Lee Oswald shot Kennedy by himself, partly because he had a screw loose, and partly to pay back JFK for the Bay of Pigs. Similar to 9-11 blowback. Like Malcolm X said: “Chickens coming home to roost.”
Secondly, any song that simpers about “He was a friend of mine” in relation to JFK makes me want to puke like swallowing a chunk of rancid pork.
Kennedy was another DP warmonger and his brother was an anti-union, Ivy League educated little prick.
Like the late, great attorney William Kuntsler once said: “The world’s a better place without the Kennedy brothers in it.”
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 13, 2010 @ 1:46 am
Leaving popular quotations and stern considerations of the 60s DP aside I was referring to Crosby speaking out the conspiracy theory regarding JFK. But do go on with your assessment that the only successful left-wing terrorist action in our lifetime(not mine tho) was committed by a complete lunatic like Oswald. If the 20th century is to be considered our lifetime then we might as well remember old Leon Czolgosz. Left wing terrorism is never desired. What did the great assassination of JFK or Mckinley achieve for any left cause?
Comment by Michael T — September 13, 2010 @ 4:03 am
["Left wing terrorism is never desired."]
That’s only your opinion, one that doesn’t withstand scrutiny.
There’s been so much right wing terror over the centuries I crave some left wing vengance wherever I can get it.
I love the story of slave revolts like Spartacus.
I smile at the Luddite history of industrial sabotage.
I read with glee about French peasant kids kicking the skulls of the aristocracy through the streets of Paris.
I stand in awe of how the Haitians drove out the French in one of history’s mightiest slave revolts.
I wished the Parisian Communards had resorted to more effective terror tactics.
I laughed when I read how some Black regimental soldiers during the American Civil War would quip before battle: “Don’t shoot ’til you see the whites.”
I’m filled with joy whenever I read accounts of Trotsky leading the defeat of White armies during the Russian Civil War.
I’m thrilled to read accounts of the Soviet Red Army’s inexorable crushing of the Nazi armies.
I consider one of the best movies ever produced to be “The Battle of Algiers” which documents how left wing terror is more often than not absolutely necessary to drive out imperialists.
I was glad the demands of the Cuban toilers forced Castro to execute 500 prison guards & other assorted Batista torturers.
Even though it was political suicide to take up arms I’m still proud of the Black Panthers.
I remember being thrilled as a kid hearing the news at the prospect of GI conscripts in Vietnam lobbing grenades into the tents of officers and the fear in the hearts of the ruling class that must have engendered.
I also remember how the hair on the back of my neck still stands up with goosebumps everytime I see the footage of that Soviet supplied NVA tank busting through the US embassy gates with that Vietnamese soldier waving that Red Army NVA flag.
I couldn’t get enough of the accounts of the Sandinistas winning urban gunfights with the Somosita National Guard. I only wish they inflicted greater left wing terror on the cowardly Contras.
When Hasenfus was shot down supplying the contras I only wished he was killed.
When Cuban armies defeated Afrikaners on that long suffering Continent I celebrated like a drunken sailor.
I thought Richard Boyle was full of shit in the movie “Salvadore” when he preached to guerillas who wouldn’t take prisoners: “You’ll become just like them!”
I considered it a rare example of justice in the world when the Somalis ambushed that Blackhawk chopper and drove out the US military.
I cheered when I read that Chavez shut down the Venezuelan equivalents of Fox News.
I could go on and on about how I believe “left wing terror” is highly desirable — but I’ve made my point.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 13, 2010 @ 5:34 am
A slave revolt is not an act of terrorism, Cuban army operations in Angola were not acts of terrorism by definition, they were organized army campaigns, just as the NLF campaigns, just as the “great patriotic war”.
An act of terrorism is an adventurist act set up by this or that sect to draw blood from an unarmed person or persons in order to satisfy that sect’s short term goal, which may be anything from its belief that that act would set the wheels of history in motion, stop the wheels of history, or to carry out petty revenge (which in actuality is the majority of the true motive behind most adventurist acts such as the Lincoln and the Mckinley assassinations, the assassination of the Gandhi-Nehru’s, the Bali bombing, the Mumbai attacks of two years back, 9/11 and what have you).
Comment by Michael T — September 13, 2010 @ 9:45 am
Sorry Mike but even the UN doesn’t agree on a definition of “terrorism.”
Historically terror isn’t just acts of lone individuals like they teach in high school. Terror is far more often used by classes & nations than individuals. For example when Reagan sent in Navy Seals under the cover of darkeness to mine Managua Harbor in the early 80′s — that was an act of terrorism.
It’s a little known fact that the first case in history of airplanes dropping bombs on civilans in a city was in 1927 in Nicaragua during the Sandino rebellion when the US Air Force sent 5 DeHaviland bi-planes over the town of Ocotal, killing around 300. It was clearly an act of terrorism.
In fact people on the Left from Proyect to Chomsky would argue that most US foreign policy is terrorism, and the victims of US imperialism would no doubt agree.
What else would you call Reagan in the 80′s sending in jetfighters to Libya to bomb Qadaffi’s house, killing his daughter?
What would Africans call Clinton after he bombed that Sudanese factory that turned out made only baby formula?
What did Iraqis call Clinton after his first official act in the White House was to shoot 4 cruise missiles randomly into Baghdad, leveling an apartment building and killing the woman who had recently won the Nobel Peace Prize for poetry?
In the 1st Gulf War the first bombs that struck targeted Baghdad’s water treatment & sewage plant. For a city of millions in the desert that was an act of terrorism.
During the 2nd Gulf War there appeared posters and t-shirts showing a picture of Bush’s stupid face with the caption” “World’s # 1 terrorist.”
That’s why there’s posters and t-shirts with a famous old picture of Geronimo with 3 other native Americans standing together & holding Winchester rifles with the caption: “Fighting terrorism since 1492.”
The high school notion that terrorism is exemplified by loners like Oswald or McVeigh is but another ruling class propaganda myth used to obfuscate what real terrorism is all about.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 13, 2010 @ 1:57 pm
Karl, the only high school notion of terrorism I’m aware of is militant acts the government and army does not agree with. And it was you who first came up with Oswald as an example of this great left-wing terrorist of our lifetime as I seem to recall. I followed that logic with my definition which is nothing to be desired.
You cannot throw all of these under the same umbrella, terrorism is not simply an act that causes the experience of terror, in that case David Cronenberg would be a terrorist.
Comment by Michael T — September 13, 2010 @ 3:41 pm
Mike: I never implied that Oswald was “great” but rather he’s an example of a historically rare left wing terrorist, albeit with a screw loose, who got his own personal mission accomplished.
Those other terrorists you mentioned weren’t for expropriating the expropriators so I don’t consider them left.
Was eliminating JFK a benefit to the left? Hardly. No more than a Narodnik’s tossing of a bomb into the Czar’s carriage could end Czarism.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 13, 2010 @ 4:00 pm
The Byrds may have been a bit Emo’ish in the 1960′s, but “Bells of Rhymney”, is based on a poem by the Welsh poet Idries Davies about the failure of the 1926 UK General Strike and the Great Depression in the United Kingdom and their effects on the South Wales coal mining valleys. Seeger just set it to music. It’s also name-checked in Anna McGarrigle’s “Going back to Harlan” in the line “Ring the bells of rhymney till they ring inside my head forever”
A nice version by Emmylou & Spyboy is here:- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYHDd7jFQls
Davies wrote: ‘I am a socialist. That is why I want as much beauty as possible in our everyday lives, and so I am an enemy of pseudo-poetry and pseudo-art of all kinds. Too many “poets of the Left”, as they call themselves,are badly in need of instruction as to the difference between poetry and propaganda….These people should read William Blake on Imagination until they show signs of understanding him. Then the air will be clear again, and the land be, if not full of, fit for song.’
Comment by prianikoff — September 14, 2010 @ 8:10 am
I don’t understand, should lefti-radicals only listen to hard stuff like the Nuggets compilation and blues bands? If you think The Byrds were little more than emo whiners check out Sweetheart of The Rodeo.
Comment by Michael T — September 14, 2010 @ 2:28 pm
Karl,
Hi hope you are well.
What about the day to day terrorism? Keeping order by economic fear of loosing a job. The terror in the inner city where the police acts as an occupying force. The assault on people out spoken. The demonizing of those who say things contrary to what is accepted.
Look at the education system and the lies it tells. Yet our children are forced to attend by law.
This day to day terrorism should not be forgotten. I recall an older job, my boss could make all demands on me but I could make none on him.
Love,
John Kaniecki
Comment by john kaniecki — September 14, 2010 @ 6:55 pm
Dear John:
Always remember – Foreign policy is just an extension of domestic policy.
Making sense of that fact is one of the great utilities of Marxism.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 14, 2010 @ 9:29 pm
Karl,
Hi hope you are well.
So to be blatantly honest, our policy is genocide (Native Americans), slavery (African Americans),exploitation (immigrants), materialsim (capitalism), repression (various assissinations). Of course you can join the gang if you are willing to sell your soul to the devil, turn a blind eye to reality, and disregard all your morals.
Oh, and don’t forget hypocrisy!!!
Unfortunately I don’t see any good countries out there, so the leads me to world revolution.
Love,
John Kaniecki
Comment by john kaniecki — September 15, 2010 @ 4:29 pm
Dear John:
White societies based on capitalism couldn’t have honed their skills of devastation and destruction of brown societies since 1492 without being masters of hypocrisy.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 15, 2010 @ 6:00 pm
Karl,
Hi hope you are well. The overt racism at the foundation of country is shown in Jefferson calling the Native Americans ‘merciless indian savages’ and making blacks a fraction of a person. Surely this open racism continued as the United States pushed further west. “The only good indians is a dead indian,” is such a horrble statement.
Yet one will notice that when the ‘problem’ is away from them they seem to develop a sense of righteousness. Thus when all the Native Americans were effectively moved West of the Mississippi you will see them getting support among the ‘liberals’ in the East. The same phenomnenon occurs today.
It comes from the human need to view themselves as righteous or good. Man was made in the image of God and thus were meant to do good. If you care to disregard God then understand the adverse psychological effects that soldiers undergo when they go to war. Killing is unnatural it goes against morals. This is why presently in the United States army suicide is at record levels. It is hard to see human beings blown away and know the carnage is from you own hands. Men want to be good. Thus someone like Hitler could only be celebrated in a twisted context. Hitler’s needed to see himself as a force of good.
That is why the lies of Manifest Destiny and the cowboy movies showing the ‘evil indian’ are perpetuated. As long as indians are perceived as an evil entity they can be dehumanized. And after all according the Manifest Destiny, America was a vast wilderness thus no evil was done. If no morals were violated then there is no reason to question the system.
Further evidence of this idea is shown in settlements and admission of guilt given to Native Americans. For example the Dutch Reformed Church has recently apologized to the Native Americans. Why?
Why can’t the pale face invader say, “I am evil and I will do as I will.” It is more than deceit to fool the naive and gullible. People like Rockefeller, Nixon, Hitler and many many petty tyrants of the capitalistic system or of any system have a need to see themselves as good. Otherwise they could not continue in their wickedness. It took hundreds of years for the Dutch Reformed Church to admit thier ‘error’. Why bother after so long a time?
Therein lies a valuable weapon. Expose the truth. Do not let them sleep easy. Keep fighting that the truth comes out. It is a weapon. The weapon can be further magnified. So called Christians do things that have nothing to do with Christ or the teachings of the Bible. Expose the hypocrisy. For example thousands of graphic photographs of horrific nature were never allowed to be shown regarding the Vietnam War. During the present United States occupations we see no photographs at all. Not only cannot we see the evil we inflict we are not allowed even to see our own dead. There are no photographs of coffins draped in the American flag.
It works both ways. Don’t you think the rulers of China who promote Marx and Lenin are concerned that their are no unions in their country, or that the worker is opressed?
In the Truth there is freedom. Too many have died and killed for lies. Stop the lies and much has been accomplished.
Love,
John Kaniecki
Comment by john kaniecki — September 15, 2010 @ 9:06 pm
I don’t get it… what does this have to do with Marxism… or anything? A bunch of emo looking mop tops rambling dime store metaphysics.
Comment by Marcel — September 9, 2010 @ 10:00 pm
Apparently the only relation to Marxism is that it was apparently written by Pete Seeger who was, as the FBI would say, a ComSymp.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 9, 2010 @ 10:03 pm
Pete “Fence sitting” Seeger? lol
Funny if this had anything to do with Marxism why is it full of such anti-dialectical none sensibilities? Almost as bad a “Let It Be.”, next Lo will be calling Lennon, Lenin!
Comment by Marcel — September 9, 2010 @ 10:23 pm
Hey, popses, stop analyzing lyric, listen to the drone and McGuinn’s twelve-string, and look at the grooving girls in the audience. Bliss!
Comment by Jim Holstun — September 9, 2010 @ 11:14 pm
The song definitely reeks of pacifism and a rosey future, neither of which the working class has in store for them.
Coca Cola Bottling Co. would have probably bought the rights and used it as a jingle except they’d never pay royalties to a fellow traveller of the CPUSA, even if they were loaded with pacifists, which they were.
A much “groovier” song from that era in my view, albeit substantially darker, is “When the Music’s Over” by The Doors.
What other 60′s rock band previsioned the modern environmetal movement & capitalist despoilation of the planet with lyrics such as this:
——————————————————————————–
What have they done to the Earth?
What have they done to our fair sister?
Ravaged and plundered and ripped her and bit her
Stuck her with knives in the side of the dawn
Tied her with fences and dragged her down
———————————————————————
For all his faults at least Morrisson was no pacifist.
The next set of lyrics even have revolutiobary implications, for when it came to taking back the Earth from the ravagers & plunderers he screamed: “WE WANT THE WORLD AND WE WANT IT NOW!
In the song “5 to 1″ he sang:
Five to one, one in five
No one here gets out alive
They got the guns but we got the numbers
Come on yea, we’re takin’ over!
Get together one more time
Get together just one more time
Come on let’s just get the whole fuckin’ thing together just one more time.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 9, 2010 @ 11:46 pm
Hah, Jim Morrison never sold out, at least. This song reminds me of the Monkeys only they took a few extra minutes to write this song. I don’t like anything about this really. This generation represented in this song is all but dead in terms of it’s revolutionary worth. The fact it is in black and white is fitting. Bland, dreary, useless. If mostly everyone born before 1970 had done us a favour and killed themselves we would be better off by now.
Comment by Marcel — September 10, 2010 @ 12:37 am
Karl,
Hi hope you are well.
Pacificism has it’s place. Don’t become the beast in trying to destroy the beast.
Love,
John Kaniecki
Comment by John Kaniecki — September 10, 2010 @ 1:00 am
If mostly everyone born before 1970 had done us a favour and killed themselves we would be better off by now.
—
Odd, I had the exact opposite reaction when I joined the SWP in 1967. I was grateful be able to learn something from people who had political experience from the 1930s unlike the SDS that had the same mixture of ultraleftism, arrogance and stupidity you favor us with.
Comment by louisproyect — September 10, 2010 @ 1:17 am
If mostly everyone born before 1970 had done us a favour and killed themselves we would be better off by now.
Yeah, then then the Reagan generation would be running things….
very few have been doing a great job on the Left for quite a while, at least in the U.S. so it’s rather hard to cast stones
Comment by purple — September 10, 2010 @ 3:44 am
“What other 60′s rock band previsioned the modern environmetal movement & capitalist despoilation of the planet…”
Comment by godoggo — September 10, 2010 @ 5:41 am
I don’t know why that embedded. Weird.
Comment by godoggo — September 10, 2010 @ 5:42 am
“Odd, I had the exact opposite reaction when I joined the SWP in 1967. I was grateful to have be able to learn something from people who had political experience from the 1930s unlike the SDS that had the same mixture of ultraleftism, arrogance and stupidity you favor us with.”
I was being sarcastic, of course, but of course Lo you would – as a typical 1st worlder – not see the difference between people that struggled in the 1930s and you privelege assholes that rule ove the world now.
Comment by Marcel — September 10, 2010 @ 7:13 am
Apparently the new litmus test for radicalism includes musical taste, as well. I suppose I’m safe since I listen to the Clash, Rage Against the Machine, and Public Enemy. Maybe that will make up for my fascination with Hildegard of Bingen and my occasional enjoyment of Lady Gaga.
Comment by Rob — September 10, 2010 @ 3:52 pm
Besides, who cares if one post, and a post that contains nothing but an embedded video at that, has “nothing to do with Marxism”? Just because we’re Marxists doesn’t mean we aren’t human and entitled to share our interests and tastes regardless of how “dialectical” they are.
Comment by Rob — September 10, 2010 @ 4:01 pm
Besides, who cares if one post, and a post that contains nothing but an embedded video at that, has “nothing to do with Marxism”?
—
Of course. This blog is not Counterpunch or Znet but an outlet for my ideas and enthusiasms, mostly political. A while back I posted this:
That is what I do. Occasionally post youtube clips of musicians I like. Get used to it.
Comment by louisproyect — September 10, 2010 @ 4:09 pm
Karl–with regard to Byrds vs. Doors: let’s just remember that, at the end (not “The End”), Jim Morrison was singing with a big band backup (“Touch Me”–no way, Jim).
Also, please remember that excellent rock critic, Rip Taylor, in “Bill and Ted’s Bogus Journey,” when listening to the Doors music: “Oh, I get it–it’s crooning in a rock MILIEU.”
Comment by Jim Holstun — September 11, 2010 @ 7:08 pm
“A time to tear down.”
Comment by Chuckie K — September 12, 2010 @ 3:16 pm
Just a great band that went through 3 musical genres in a matter of 4 years so masterfully.. and there was also this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Bb4DpejUUA
Although Mr. Proyect may not like it.
Comment by Michael T — September 13, 2010 @ 1:27 am
I’m guessing Louis loathes that number as much as me. I know I despise it.
First it denies the only successful left wing terrorist action in our lifetime. Lee Oswald shot Kennedy by himself, partly because he had a screw loose, and partly to pay back JFK for the Bay of Pigs. Similar to 9-11 blowback. Like Malcolm X said: “Chickens coming home to roost.”
Secondly, any song that simpers about “He was a friend of mine” in relation to JFK makes me want to puke like swallowing a chunk of rancid pork.
Kennedy was another DP warmonger and his brother was an anti-union, Ivy League educated little prick.
Like the late, great attorney William Kuntsler once said: “The world’s a better place without the Kennedy brothers in it.”
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 13, 2010 @ 1:46 am
Leaving popular quotations and stern considerations of the 60s DP aside I was referring to Crosby speaking out the conspiracy theory regarding JFK. But do go on with your assessment that the only successful left-wing terrorist action in our lifetime(not mine tho) was committed by a complete lunatic like Oswald. If the 20th century is to be considered our lifetime then we might as well remember old Leon Czolgosz. Left wing terrorism is never desired. What did the great assassination of JFK or Mckinley achieve for any left cause?
Comment by Michael T — September 13, 2010 @ 4:03 am
["Left wing terrorism is never desired."]
That’s only your opinion, one that doesn’t withstand scrutiny.
There’s been so much right wing terror over the centuries I crave some left wing vengance wherever I can get it.
I love the story of slave revolts like Spartacus.
I smile at the Luddite history of industrial sabotage.
I read with glee about French peasant kids kicking the skulls of the aristocracy through the streets of Paris.
I stand in awe of how the Haitians drove out the French in one of history’s mightiest slave revolts.
I wished the Parisian Communards had resorted to more effective terror tactics.
I laughed when I read how some Black regimental soldiers during the American Civil War would quip before battle: “Don’t shoot ’til you see the whites.”
I’m filled with joy whenever I read accounts of Trotsky leading the defeat of White armies during the Russian Civil War.
I’m thrilled to read accounts of the Soviet Red Army’s inexorable crushing of the Nazi armies.
I consider one of the best movies ever produced to be “The Battle of Algiers” which documents how left wing terror is more often than not absolutely necessary to drive out imperialists.
I was glad the demands of the Cuban toilers forced Castro to execute 500 prison guards & other assorted Batista torturers.
Even though it was political suicide to take up arms I’m still proud of the Black Panthers.
I remember being thrilled as a kid hearing the news at the prospect of GI conscripts in Vietnam lobbing grenades into the tents of officers and the fear in the hearts of the ruling class that must have engendered.
I also remember how the hair on the back of my neck still stands up with goosebumps everytime I see the footage of that Soviet supplied NVA tank busting through the US embassy gates with that Vietnamese soldier waving that Red Army NVA flag.
I couldn’t get enough of the accounts of the Sandinistas winning urban gunfights with the Somosita National Guard. I only wish they inflicted greater left wing terror on the cowardly Contras.
When Hasenfus was shot down supplying the contras I only wished he was killed.
When Cuban armies defeated Afrikaners on that long suffering Continent I celebrated like a drunken sailor.
I thought Richard Boyle was full of shit in the movie “Salvadore” when he preached to guerillas who wouldn’t take prisoners: “You’ll become just like them!”
I considered it a rare example of justice in the world when the Somalis ambushed that Blackhawk chopper and drove out the US military.
I cheered when I read that Chavez shut down the Venezuelan equivalents of Fox News.
I could go on and on about how I believe “left wing terror” is highly desirable — but I’ve made my point.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 13, 2010 @ 5:34 am
A slave revolt is not an act of terrorism, Cuban army operations in Angola were not acts of terrorism by definition, they were organized army campaigns, just as the NLF campaigns, just as the “great patriotic war”.
An act of terrorism is an adventurist act set up by this or that sect to draw blood from an unarmed person or persons in order to satisfy that sect’s short term goal, which may be anything from its belief that that act would set the wheels of history in motion, stop the wheels of history, or to carry out petty revenge (which in actuality is the majority of the true motive behind most adventurist acts such as the Lincoln and the Mckinley assassinations, the assassination of the Gandhi-Nehru’s, the Bali bombing, the Mumbai attacks of two years back, 9/11 and what have you).
Comment by Michael T — September 13, 2010 @ 9:45 am
Sorry Mike but even the UN doesn’t agree on a definition of “terrorism.”
Historically terror isn’t just acts of lone individuals like they teach in high school. Terror is far more often used by classes & nations than individuals. For example when Reagan sent in Navy Seals under the cover of darkeness to mine Managua Harbor in the early 80′s — that was an act of terrorism.
It’s a little known fact that the first case in history of airplanes dropping bombs on civilans in a city was in 1927 in Nicaragua during the Sandino rebellion when the US Air Force sent 5 DeHaviland bi-planes over the town of Ocotal, killing around 300. It was clearly an act of terrorism.
http://www.sandinorebellion.com/HomePages/airtoons.html
In fact people on the Left from Proyect to Chomsky would argue that most US foreign policy is terrorism, and the victims of US imperialism would no doubt agree.
What else would you call Reagan in the 80′s sending in jetfighters to Libya to bomb Qadaffi’s house, killing his daughter?
What would Africans call Clinton after he bombed that Sudanese factory that turned out made only baby formula?
What did Iraqis call Clinton after his first official act in the White House was to shoot 4 cruise missiles randomly into Baghdad, leveling an apartment building and killing the woman who had recently won the Nobel Peace Prize for poetry?
In the 1st Gulf War the first bombs that struck targeted Baghdad’s water treatment & sewage plant. For a city of millions in the desert that was an act of terrorism.
During the 2nd Gulf War there appeared posters and t-shirts showing a picture of Bush’s stupid face with the caption” “World’s # 1 terrorist.”
That’s why there’s posters and t-shirts with a famous old picture of Geronimo with 3 other native Americans standing together & holding Winchester rifles with the caption: “Fighting terrorism since 1492.”
http://www.fightingterrorismsince1492.com/
The high school notion that terrorism is exemplified by loners like Oswald or McVeigh is but another ruling class propaganda myth used to obfuscate what real terrorism is all about.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 13, 2010 @ 1:57 pm
Karl, the only high school notion of terrorism I’m aware of is militant acts the government and army does not agree with. And it was you who first came up with Oswald as an example of this great left-wing terrorist of our lifetime as I seem to recall. I followed that logic with my definition which is nothing to be desired.
You cannot throw all of these under the same umbrella, terrorism is not simply an act that causes the experience of terror, in that case David Cronenberg would be a terrorist.
Comment by Michael T — September 13, 2010 @ 3:41 pm
Mike: I never implied that Oswald was “great” but rather he’s an example of a historically rare left wing terrorist, albeit with a screw loose, who got his own personal mission accomplished.
Those other terrorists you mentioned weren’t for expropriating the expropriators so I don’t consider them left.
Was eliminating JFK a benefit to the left? Hardly. No more than a Narodnik’s tossing of a bomb into the Czar’s carriage could end Czarism.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 13, 2010 @ 4:00 pm
The Byrds may have been a bit Emo’ish in the 1960′s, but “Bells of Rhymney”, is based on a poem by the Welsh poet Idries Davies about the failure of the 1926 UK General Strike and the Great Depression in the United Kingdom and their effects on the South Wales coal mining valleys. Seeger just set it to music. It’s also name-checked in Anna McGarrigle’s “Going back to Harlan” in the line “Ring the bells of rhymney till they ring inside my head forever”
A nice version by Emmylou & Spyboy is here:-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYHDd7jFQls
Davies wrote: ‘I am a socialist. That is why I want as much beauty as possible in our everyday lives, and so I am an enemy of pseudo-poetry and pseudo-art of all kinds. Too many “poets of the Left”, as they call themselves,are badly in need of instruction as to the difference between poetry and propaganda….These people should read William Blake on Imagination until they show signs of understanding him. Then the air will be clear again, and the land be, if not full of, fit for song.’
Comment by prianikoff — September 14, 2010 @ 8:10 am
I don’t understand, should lefti-radicals only listen to hard stuff like the Nuggets compilation and blues bands? If you think The Byrds were little more than emo whiners check out Sweetheart of The Rodeo.
Comment by Michael T — September 14, 2010 @ 2:28 pm
Karl,
Hi hope you are well.
What about the day to day terrorism? Keeping order by economic fear of loosing a job. The terror in the inner city where the police acts as an occupying force. The assault on people out spoken. The demonizing of those who say things contrary to what is accepted.
Look at the education system and the lies it tells. Yet our children are forced to attend by law.
This day to day terrorism should not be forgotten. I recall an older job, my boss could make all demands on me but I could make none on him.
Love,
John Kaniecki
Comment by john kaniecki — September 14, 2010 @ 6:55 pm
Dear John:
Always remember – Foreign policy is just an extension of domestic policy.
Making sense of that fact is one of the great utilities of Marxism.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 14, 2010 @ 9:29 pm
Karl,
Hi hope you are well.
So to be blatantly honest, our policy is genocide (Native Americans), slavery (African Americans),exploitation (immigrants), materialsim (capitalism), repression (various assissinations). Of course you can join the gang if you are willing to sell your soul to the devil, turn a blind eye to reality, and disregard all your morals.
Oh, and don’t forget hypocrisy!!!
Unfortunately I don’t see any good countries out there, so the leads me to world revolution.
Love,
John Kaniecki
Comment by john kaniecki — September 15, 2010 @ 4:29 pm
Dear John:
White societies based on capitalism couldn’t have honed their skills of devastation and destruction of brown societies since 1492 without being masters of hypocrisy.
Comment by Karl Friedrich — September 15, 2010 @ 6:00 pm
Karl,
Hi hope you are well. The overt racism at the foundation of country is shown in Jefferson calling the Native Americans ‘merciless indian savages’ and making blacks a fraction of a person. Surely this open racism continued as the United States pushed further west. “The only good indians is a dead indian,” is such a horrble statement.
Yet one will notice that when the ‘problem’ is away from them they seem to develop a sense of righteousness. Thus when all the Native Americans were effectively moved West of the Mississippi you will see them getting support among the ‘liberals’ in the East. The same phenomnenon occurs today.
It comes from the human need to view themselves as righteous or good. Man was made in the image of God and thus were meant to do good. If you care to disregard God then understand the adverse psychological effects that soldiers undergo when they go to war. Killing is unnatural it goes against morals. This is why presently in the United States army suicide is at record levels. It is hard to see human beings blown away and know the carnage is from you own hands. Men want to be good. Thus someone like Hitler could only be celebrated in a twisted context. Hitler’s needed to see himself as a force of good.
That is why the lies of Manifest Destiny and the cowboy movies showing the ‘evil indian’ are perpetuated. As long as indians are perceived as an evil entity they can be dehumanized. And after all according the Manifest Destiny, America was a vast wilderness thus no evil was done. If no morals were violated then there is no reason to question the system.
Further evidence of this idea is shown in settlements and admission of guilt given to Native Americans. For example the Dutch Reformed Church has recently apologized to the Native Americans. Why?
Why can’t the pale face invader say, “I am evil and I will do as I will.” It is more than deceit to fool the naive and gullible. People like Rockefeller, Nixon, Hitler and many many petty tyrants of the capitalistic system or of any system have a need to see themselves as good. Otherwise they could not continue in their wickedness. It took hundreds of years for the Dutch Reformed Church to admit thier ‘error’. Why bother after so long a time?
Therein lies a valuable weapon. Expose the truth. Do not let them sleep easy. Keep fighting that the truth comes out. It is a weapon. The weapon can be further magnified. So called Christians do things that have nothing to do with Christ or the teachings of the Bible. Expose the hypocrisy. For example thousands of graphic photographs of horrific nature were never allowed to be shown regarding the Vietnam War. During the present United States occupations we see no photographs at all. Not only cannot we see the evil we inflict we are not allowed even to see our own dead. There are no photographs of coffins draped in the American flag.
It works both ways. Don’t you think the rulers of China who promote Marx and Lenin are concerned that their are no unions in their country, or that the worker is opressed?
In the Truth there is freedom. Too many have died and killed for lies. Stop the lies and much has been accomplished.
Love,
John Kaniecki
Comment by john kaniecki — September 15, 2010 @ 9:06 pm