Comments on: Art as commodity http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/ Sat, 19 Jul 2008 03:46:12 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=MU By: m.c. http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38795 m.c. Sat, 01 Mar 2008 19:04:07 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38795 “It is style which makes it possible to act effectively, it is style which enables us to find a harmony between the pursuit of ends essential to us, and a regard for the views, the sensibilities, the aspirations of those to whom the problem may appear in another light; it is style which is the deference that action pays to uncertainty; it is above all style through which power defers to reason.” ~Robert Oppenheimer This is one of my favorite quotes, especially in the context of Kitsch, Cliche, Caricature, & Stereotype. “It is style which makes it possible to act effectively, it is style which enables us to find a harmony between the pursuit of ends essential to us, and a regard for the views, the sensibilities, the aspirations of those to whom the problem may appear in another light; it is style which is the deference that action pays to uncertainty; it is above all style through which power defers to reason.”
~Robert Oppenheimer

This is one of my favorite quotes, especially in the context of Kitsch, Cliche, Caricature, & Stereotype.

]]> By: Martin Wisse http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38754 Martin Wisse Tue, 26 Feb 2008 20:11:14 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38754 Dave, do blame the right person for these snobby remarks; it was I, not Louis, who made them. And yes, I do agree they were snobbish, but then again John Steppling was asking to have his pomposity punctured. Being a Marxist does not necessarily means dropping one's standards of English however; we're not post-modernists! Dave, do blame the right person for these snobby remarks; it was I, not Louis, who made them. And yes, I do agree they were snobbish, but then again John Steppling was asking to have his pomposity punctured. Being a Marxist does not necessarily means dropping one’s standards of English however; we’re not post-modernists!

]]> By: m.c. http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38724 m.c. Fri, 22 Feb 2008 20:24:41 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38724 "Condescension is the High Price of Art" I wrote this in an English Lit. paper in college, at the time thinking I was the next Oscar Wilde with his pithy literary proverbs, and trying to understand F.R. Leavis & Edmund Wilson's criticisms. I get the Blooms mixed up too. Earl Shorris in a 2004 Harpers Essay on Leo Strauss(its online: google Earl Shorris + Harpers + Leo Strauss) calls Allan his most famous student(more famous than Paul Wolfowitz??) a vicious misogynist. “Condescension is the High Price of Art”

I wrote this in an English Lit. paper in college, at the time thinking I was the next Oscar Wilde with his pithy literary proverbs, and trying to understand F.R. Leavis & Edmund Wilson’s criticisms. I get the Blooms mixed up too. Earl Shorris in a 2004 Harpers Essay on Leo Strauss(its online: google Earl Shorris + Harpers + Leo Strauss) calls Allan his most famous student(more famous than Paul Wolfowitz??) a vicious misogynist.

]]> By: Peter Byrne http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38723 Peter Byrne Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:21:34 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38723 Going back to #9, it seems to me that the artist is, and has been for centuries, working in an ironic margin. You underline it when you note that “Das Capital” is also for sale. The artist’s work will be treated as a commodity. His aim should be, all the same, to express non-commercial values. Part of criticism’s role is to point out the latter. For instance, referring back to #6, the critic will show that Farrell expresses values Caldwell ignores. The danger of wielding too freely a blunderbuss concept like the “commodification” of art is that it directs attention away from the artist’s concrete problem. Of course he would operate differently in a non-mercantile world, but he hasn’t had that opportunity since (maybe) the Middle Ages. By the way, in the irony department, Tatlin’s monument to the Third International has been realized, after a fashion, by the merchants of the tourist and museum industries. The current Russian exhibition at the Royal Academy shows the tower superimposed on a film of St. Petersburg as if it were in fact part of the urban architecture. Going back to #9, it seems to me that the artist is, and has been for centuries, working in an ironic margin. You underline it when you note that “Das Capital” is also for sale. The artist’s work will be treated as a commodity. His aim should be, all the same, to express non-commercial values. Part of criticism’s role is to point out the latter. For instance, referring back to #6, the critic will show that Farrell expresses values Caldwell ignores. The danger of wielding too freely a blunderbuss concept like the “commodification” of art is that it directs attention away from the artist’s concrete problem. Of course he would operate differently in a non-mercantile world, but he hasn’t had that opportunity since (maybe) the Middle Ages. By the way, in the irony department, Tatlin’s monument to the Third International has been realized, after a fashion, by the merchants of the tourist and museum industries. The current Russian exhibition at the Royal Academy shows the tower superimposed on a film of St. Petersburg as if it were in fact part of the urban architecture.

]]> By: Dave http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38722 Dave Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:18:59 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38722 I would just like to comment on the statement you made about Stepplings spelling errors. I have no opinion on the Cormac McCarthy or the movie No Country For old Men sense I have neither read his books or seen the movie. As I have said befor Louis I love your site, but it's snobby comments like this one that really piss me off. I make spelling errors too, so what, am I not alllowed to express my belief on what is great literature. This seems to be a very elitist stance for a marxist to take. Stepplings comment was on the way McCarthy depicts his characters, not on how he constructs sentences. Instead of dealing with his point you made a snide comment about improper grammer. I will say that I agree with your main point that there are lots of things that elites tell us were supposed to like, but are ultimately equal parts pretentious and boring. There are many of your more contrarian movie reviews I have agreed with like your review of Little Miss Sunshine which I fully agree was extremely overated. When I do see No Country For Old Men I may end up fully agreeing with your sentiments, but when you make snide comments like this I think your damaging your cause. I would just like to comment on the statement you made about Stepplings spelling errors. I have no opinion on the Cormac McCarthy or the movie No Country For old Men sense I have neither read his books or seen the movie.

As I have said befor Louis I love your site, but it’s snobby comments like this one that really piss me off. I make spelling errors too, so what, am I not alllowed to express my belief on what is great literature. This seems to be a very elitist stance for a marxist to take. Stepplings comment was on the way McCarthy depicts his characters, not on how he constructs sentences. Instead of dealing with his point you made a snide comment about improper grammer.

I will say that I agree with your main point that there are lots of things that elites tell us were supposed to like, but are ultimately equal parts pretentious and boring. There are many of your more contrarian movie reviews I have agreed with like your review of Little Miss Sunshine which I fully agree was extremely overated. When I do see No Country For Old Men I may end up fully agreeing with your sentiments, but when you make snide comments like this I think your damaging your cause.

]]> By: Dennis Brasky http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38721 Dennis Brasky Fri, 22 Feb 2008 15:41:38 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38721 "It took much longer for music to catch up, but with the introduction of the phonograph, the composer found a way to tap into the mass market as well." Long before the phonograph, musicians prospered with the sale of sheet music. By the 1840s/50s many middle class families could afford a piano as well as other instruments and could thus create concerts in their own homes. Reductions of symphonies and string quartets for 2 or 4 hands at the piano as well as operatic transcriptions and paraphrases were a great source of income for Liszt and the child of the Hamburg slums, Brahms. “It took much longer for music to catch up, but with the introduction of the phonograph, the composer found a way to tap into the mass market as well.”

Long before the phonograph, musicians prospered with the sale of sheet music. By the 1840s/50s many middle class families could afford a piano as well as other instruments and could thus create concerts in their own homes. Reductions of symphonies and string quartets for 2 or 4 hands at the piano as well as operatic transcriptions and paraphrases were a great source of income for Liszt and the child of the Hamburg slums, Brahms.

]]> By: Rolf http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38720 Rolf Fri, 22 Feb 2008 15:39:56 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38720 Byrne: Of course you have a good point, but selling photos (or models) of his utopian projects doesn’t mean that Talin failed. Karl Marx “Das Capital” is also sold on the market. Tatlin`s concept of the monument Third International was never realised; lack of electricity was one aspect – the other was Lenin and the Communist Party incompetence concerning artistic questions. Mexican Diego Rivera sold easel paintings and portraits of rich people, but this was bread-works. Sometimes revolutionary artists also have to buy milk and butter. The artmarket`s repressive tolerance is incredible and totally absurd. In 2000 the Tate bought a tin purporting to be the excrement of Italian artist Piero Manzoni for £22,350 from Sotheby's. The conservative art critic Robert Hughes calls it cultural obscenity. But DADA-Manzoni`s effort to ridicule bourgeois art taste doesn’t necessarily mean that provoking Institution Art from inside is wasted time? Byrne: Of course you have a good point, but selling photos (or models) of his utopian projects doesn’t mean that Talin failed. Karl Marx “Das Capital” is also sold on the market.

Tatlin`s concept of the monument Third International was never realised; lack of electricity was one aspect – the other was Lenin and the Communist Party incompetence concerning artistic questions.

Mexican Diego Rivera sold easel paintings and portraits of rich people, but this was bread-works. Sometimes revolutionary artists also have to buy milk and butter.

The artmarket`s repressive tolerance is incredible and totally absurd. In 2000 the Tate bought a tin purporting to be the excrement of Italian artist Piero Manzoni for £22,350 from Sotheby’s. The conservative art critic Robert Hughes calls it cultural obscenity. But DADA-Manzoni`s effort to ridicule bourgeois art taste doesn’t necessarily mean that provoking Institution Art from inside is wasted time?

]]> By: » Culture Wars II > Cyrano’s Journal /• ||| Placebo ART http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38719 » Culture Wars II > Cyrano’s Journal /• ||| Placebo ART Fri, 22 Feb 2008 10:21:38 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38719 [...] http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/ [...] [...] http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/ [...]

]]> By: Peter Byrne http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38717 Peter Byrne Fri, 22 Feb 2008 05:14:46 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38717 # 5. Currently in London there are key works by Vladimir Tatlin and Alexandr Rodchenko on temporary display. You have to pay a hefty charge to get into both the Royal Academy and the Hayward Gallery. So I suppose you could say that the revolutionary avant-garde has failed to prevent art from being transformed into a commodity. # 6. Right. That books have become commodities is hardly hot news. But someone who wants to talk seriously about them still has to distinguish a Caldwell from a Farrell. That operation has nothing to do with establishing a canon. # 5. Currently in London there are key works by Vladimir Tatlin and Alexandr Rodchenko on temporary display. You have to pay a hefty charge to get into both the Royal Academy and the Hayward Gallery. So I suppose you could say that the revolutionary avant-garde has failed to prevent art from being transformed into a commodity.

# 6. Right. That books have become commodities is hardly hot news. But someone who wants to talk seriously about them still has to distinguish a Caldwell from a Farrell. That operation has nothing to do with establishing a canon.

]]> By: Chuckie K http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/2008/02/21/art-as-commodity/#comment-38715 Chuckie K Thu, 21 Feb 2008 21:03:38 +0000 http://louisproyect.wordpress.com/?p=626#comment-38715 "frightened by characters when they are constructed ... without conventional sentimentality and motivation" does not seem to me to be the issue. Compare Erskine Caldwell and James Farrell. No sentiment, but a world of difference in how you come away feeling about the characters. "the elevation of reading novels and poetry into a kind of transcendental sacrament" Marx and Engles themselves saw art as one of the principal futures replacemtns of religion. Characteristic 19th century secular Geist. “frightened by characters when they are constructed … without conventional sentimentality and motivation” does not seem to me to be the issue. Compare Erskine Caldwell and James Farrell. No sentiment, but a world of difference in how you come away feeling about the characters.

“the elevation of reading novels and poetry into a kind of transcendental sacrament” Marx and Engles themselves saw art as one of the principal futures replacemtns of religion. Characteristic 19th century secular Geist.

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